[00:00:00] Mary Czarnecki: Your product is not going to be as perfectly packaged, delivered, and marketed as much as you want it to be as the products that you’re selling now for someone else. And I think that transition from employee to entrepreneur, there is that shift in, “It has to be perfect ’cause that’s what I’m being paid for and that’s what I’m measured on. Those are my KPIs for my job,” as opposed to, especially as a startup or a solopreneur, “80% is good enough to go.” Right? You just have to let go of perfection.
[00:00:42] Bumper Intro-Outro: Welcome to Endless Coffee Cup, a regular discussion of marketing news, culture, and media for our complex digital lifestyle. Join Matt Bailey as he engages in conversation to find insights beyond the latest headlines and deeper understanding for those involved in marketing. Grab a cup of coffee, have a seat, and thanks for joining.
[00:01:04] Matt Bailey: Well, hello, and welcome to another edition of the Endless Coffee Cup podcast. I’m your host as always Matt Bailey and I’ve got a returning guest, Mary Czarnecki. Mary, how are you doing today?
[00:01:15] Mary Czarnecki: Doing great, thanks. Got my coffee and ready to go.
[00:01:18] Matt Bailey: Okay. Let’s start with that. You are a coffee drinker. What is your go-to coffee? What’s your favorite coffee?
[00:01:25] Mary Czarnecki: So, go-to at home I’d probably say I either go with some kind of unique blend or bean that a friend has recently recommended, but I’d say more often than not I rely on my Nespresso machine. So, I go for the quick cup.
[00:01:39] Matt Bailey: Nespresso. Wow. Wow. I remember like, my first experience with Nespresso was on a trip in Europe and I was in a recording studio, and they basically handed me two boxes of Nespresso pods and said, “Here’s your coffee for the week.” And, you know, I was, “What? What? Where is the…?” It was alright. I, I have a Costa Rican Peaberry this morning.
[00:02:04] Mary Czarnecki: Ohhhh.
[00:02:05] Matt Bailey: It is my favorite cup. My favorite…
[00:02:08] Mary Czarnecki: That’s amazing.
[00:02:08] Matt Bailey: …my, my all-time, I don’t know what it is about the peaberry, the small beans. It just has such a delicate, and listen to me. I am, I’m such a snob.
[00:02:18] Mary Czarnecki: I’m a total snob. Ever since I started drinking it black, it really makes a difference. That’s why, you know, we had, we had gotten a Keurig actually as a gift and I had to no, no offense Keurig, if you’re listening, but had to stop because…
[00:02:32] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:02:32] Mary Czarnecki: …because the pods were plastic, I could taste it in the coffee when you’re not adding anything to it, so.
[00:02:37] Matt Bailey: Yeah, it’s not, as someone explained to me, the Keurig is not an ideal coffee delivery mechanism because it doesn’t allow the, it doesn’t allow it to steep.
[00:02:50] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah. Yeah.
[00:02:51] Matt Bailey: And you need that steeping time in order to get the maximum amount of flavor from it.
[00:02:55] Mary Czarnecki: I agree.
[00:02:56] Matt Bailey: I do all pour over. I, I, I’m 100% pour over.
[00:02:58] Mary Czarnecki: I’m a total pour over, yeah.
[00:02:59] Matt Bailey: Yeah, that is my…
[00:03:00] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah.
[00:03:01] Matt Bailey: …and especially with these delicate, more delicate, balanced cups and yeah, like it, black coffee, black, that’s the only way you get the taste.
[00:03:08] Mary Czarnecki: Oh yeah.
[00:03:09] Matt Bailey: I have relatives that dump cream and sugar in to the point where I, I think it’s the old Seinfeld thing. Well, then you don’t like coffee. What you have is a coffee shake.
[00:03:20] Mary Czarnecki: Yes. Yes. Really, it’s more like coffee ice cream at this point.
[00:03:25] Matt Bailey: Right. Yeah. Absolutely. Like, no, you like sugar and creamer is what you like. You just, coffee is an excuse to drink all this stuff with it.
[00:03:35] Mary Czarnecki: Completely, a hundred percent.
[00:03:36] Matt Bailey: Oh, alright, Mary. So, I put it out earlier this year and just kind of a, “Hey, did you know that more people are searching for how to start a business than how to get a job?” And I mean, we are in an absolutely amazing time right now, the great resignation, anti-work, all kinds of things going on and people are taking the leap to start their own thing.
I think that’s so exciting. I mean, you and I both we’re, we’re kind of independent, on our own, and I think, you know, we can both remember the fear, the absolute fear of that. And, and you jumped on it. You’re like, “Yes, let’s talk about this.” And, so you’re seeing it as well. How are, how are people approaching you or, or talking with you about this?
[00:04:26] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah, for sure. I, I definitely have seen that uptick. I mean, you can look at the data, but I, I know from personal experience it’s true. Just because I’ve got not just clients and students that have always had an interest in entrepreneurial venture, but I’ve got folks that have been lifelong friends, folks that I’ve worked with in corporate, people that I thought were, you know, dyed in the wool forever, you know, planning their career in corporate, reach out to me sometimes completely out of the blue asking questions like, “So, you do this business owner thing. What, what’s involved in that? What does that look like?”
And I’ve also had people say, “Okay, well, I’m not, I’m not looking to replace my corporate career. I’m comfortable, I’m happy, I’ve gotten a certain level of success, but I want, I want to create my own platform. I want to,” and I’ve, I might trademark this this year, but, “I want to become fireproof. Like, I want to become…”
[00:05:21] Matt Bailey: Oh, wow.
[00:05:22] Mary Czarnecki: …”fireproof. Like, if you fire me, fine, because I’ve already got a platform. I’ve already got an audience. I’ve already got an expertise.” And I think people are embracing different options because they’ve got different priorities. Something that they got to see potentially while they were in quarantine, something that they potentially got to see while having to work remotely in a different kind of situation. And when people get scared, sometimes our perspective change. And I think a lot of people have gotten scared in different ways at different levels over the past two years, but I think that change in perspective is, ask, made people ask different questions.
[00:05:59] Matt Bailey: Absolutely. I, I mean, like I said, this is extraordinary circumstances. My wife, I am no longer allowed to use the word unprecedented. She’s like, “I’m so sick of that word.” So, now I just say it just to get her going, but it, it is so true that this is something so life-changing, that’s, that we’re going through, and I think it has forced people to rethink things.
And if, for example, in our town, there’s, you know, a couple of agencies that I do work with and I know people there, and one agency has, they went virtual prior to the pandemic. They actually had a problem with their building. And so, you know what? They, I think they were virtual three to four days a week, so when the pandemic came, it was just, “Oh, cool. Okay. We can move with this.”
Another agency went hybrid and has their office space up for sale. And another agency made everyone come back the day the lockdown was over, and wow. To hear the responses from different people and how, seeing that, knowing this, what’s going on, I think people were starting to ask that, like, “Am I really happy? Is, is this what I want to do?” And I think circumstances play a lot into that role of, of that fear, like you said, and maybe, you know, helping people see that there’s, there’s some other opportunities out here.
[00:07:25] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah, for sure. And I think also just, you know, obviously the news coverage of who was going remote, who was going hybrid, who was forcing employees to go back to, to the office and then just the stories of what people were doing while they were working from home or how they were working, I think gave people a window in an, into an area of more people’s lives that we don’t normally have. You know what I mean? It’s kind of like, we don’t normally really know what’s going on in other people’s marriages, right? But we don’t also really know what’s going on in other people’s careers.
[00:07:56] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:07:56] Mary Czarnecki: What is it like in an office culture, in an office environment that we don’t know anyone in, we don’t have any experience or exposure to, and I think a lot of people who maybe thought there was no option to work in a different way, suddenly saw people like them working in a different way. And they were like, “Whoa, whoa, whoa. This is possible? Like, this is, this is a thing? Like, if they can do this, I could totally do this.” Right? So, I think it gave people this opportunity to really reconsider, “Wow, there, this is something that people are doing. This isn’t totally out of, out of possibility.”
[00:08:39] Matt Bailey: Absolutely. And the opportunities I, you know, with the pandemic, it’s shut down certain things, but it has created an amazing amount of opportunities. And that, and that’s one thing I love seeing LinkedIn with different people and products being developed, business ideas. It, it’s absolutely amazing and I love it because, you know, it’s like the circumstances are just perfect to just, “Let, let’s do it. Let’s start.” And with the remote, you can even start at the same time. You can…
[00:09:12] Mary Czarnecki: Yes.
[00:09:13] Matt Bailey: Shhhh.
[00:09:13] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah. No, I think, I mean, for me, I, I always knew that there were people that work remote and I’m, I’m one of those that’s actually been working remotely since 2007, at that point, I was working for, you know, a corporate job. I had just had the opportunity to work for a New York office while living in Oregon. But it did involve travel because I was, I was the unicorn, right?
[00:10:00] I was the strange person who worked remotely, and no one really understood what that meant. But then when I really started talking to people about this online entrepreneurship or this, you know, virtual business owner opportunity, it, it really did open my eyes. So, I think I have a lot of empathy for the people who suddenly are realizing that there are new opportunities, and especially like you said, with mark, the market has different needs now than they had two years ago, three years ago. And there are businesses that have popped up recognizing those needs, and as a marketer, that gets me all excited, right?
[00:10:06] Matt Bailey: Absolutely. Absolutely. So, let me ask you this. You, you, you consult businesses, and, you know, I, I think you’re, you’re, you might start moving more into startups here in the next year or two.
[00:10:18] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah.
[00:10:18] Matt Bailey: But when someone comes to you and says, “I’m thinking about doing this,” what’s your first response?
[00:10:27] Mary Czarnecki: I guess I always ask the question, “Why?” ‘Cause I know having gone through it, that for some people it’s a thought exercise, right? For some people they’re not gonna, they’re not really looking to go through with this. They’re just really looking to figure out, you know, what could this look like? They’re not ready to, to change anything right now. And there are other people that are really ready to go. And so, for me, the question always starts with “Why,” which is, “Why are you doing this?” and then, “When are you looking to make this happen?” Right? “Is this, is this something that you’re already kind of jumping into or is this something you’re just trying to lay the groundwork for, something maybe two years, three years, five years down the road?”
[00:11:11] Matt Bailey: Yeah, absolutely. It’s, I, I think there’s that, that big difference of more just investigating what, what do I need to do? I think that’s probably one of the biggest questions. And, and, and that’s so hard to answer. Um, I’ve had a number of people on LinkedIn tell me, you know, “I’m planning, making a move. I thought I would be here for years, but now I’m considering something.” And the one thing I’ve been telling people is, “Well, don’t wait. Start something.” Uh, start a website, start a blog, start getting your name out there and start becoming an authority. You don’t have to wait on that, but I think you, you make a good question. What does it look like?
[00:11:49] Mary Czarnecki: Right.
[00:11:49] Matt Bailey: And, and that’s probably the hardest part to wrap your mind around.
[00:11:53] Mary Czarnecki: No, but I completely agree with you. So, you know, no matter whether someone’s saying, “Oh, well, I just, I just wanted to understand, you know, hearing all this, I wanted to know what my options were,” or, you know, “Our company is being acquired,” or, “My boss is leaving,” or, you know, “I really don’t like the fact that we have to do work in this way anymore.” And it, it has to happen now, like we’re on a short timeframe.
I completely a hundred percent agree with you that there’s no reason whatsoever that anyone that’s had, honestly, more than a year’s of experience, shouldn’t be going out and creating their own platform. Right? Their own expert based stage, essentially, where they can share their experience, their skills, their expertise because even if you’re just one step, two step, three steps down the road from someone else on a journey, you’ve got value to add to them.
[00:12:44] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:12:45] Mary Czarnecki: And especially the people, I’m sure, that you’re talking to, I know the people I’m talking to, we’re not talking about one year out of college. We’re talking about people that have a depth of experience.
[00:12:53] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:12:54] Mary Czarnecki: And a lot of value to share. I think that there’s absolutely no reason to wait.
[00:12:59] Matt Bailey: No, not at all, and it’s so interesting I think that the different things that people are curious about, because like you said, they have a depth of experience, but sometimes it’s, it’s a completely, a complete shift away from what they’re doing into, “I see an opportunity over here, and it’s something I love.” And, now I will say this. I absolutely hate the term “side hustle.”
[00:13:24] Mary Czarnecki: Yes.
[00:13:25] Matt Bailey: I hate it. I hate seeing it. I hate reading it. I hate hearing it because I think it cheapens what your skills and abilities are. It’s not a side hustle. It’s, it’s a passion project. It’s something that’s been in my mind. It’s, it’s, uh, something I love, and I can make money with it. I, I just think the term side hustle cheapens the whole thing. I just, ugh, I don’t like it.
[00:13:54] Mary Czarnecki: I don’t mind the side part, but I agree. Putting it together, when I think “side hustle,” it’s something where literally you’re hustling.
[00:14:00] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:14:00] Mary Czarnecki: Like, you know, you’re working a full-time job, then you’re going to work at a boutique or you’re working at Uber. You’re, you know, those, I feel like it, it does have a sense of this kind of, you know, you’re, you’re putting in this extra effort, it’s kind of almost like a frantic feeling, but I think, yeah, I like the idea of this passion project being this, it’s something different. It’s not a side hustle.
It’s really showcasing what you’ve been providing as value potentially to your company, your employer, your other partnership, whatever you’ve been in. And now you’re packaging it and presenting it to an audience in a way that you own. Right?
You control the conversation, you control the topic, and I love the idea that, you know, what you just touched on, which is sometimes it’s directly related to the work that you’ve been doing in your career so far. And sometimes that’s finally being able to shine the spotlight on an aspect of yourself that has always just been kind of in the shadows. Right? So, I think that both things are, are a key opportunity to build that platform based on what makes you excited to talk about for multiple hours a week.
[00:15:10] Matt Bailey: Well, so yeah, this is the podcast. I mean, this is, it’s an, I, I was explaining to someone the other day, it is an excuse for me to talk to my friends and, and just record the conversation and other people listen to it. And I, I love the format. I love being in touch with people and, and building these relationships. Now, I will say, I’m not monetizing. This, it ha, it better be a passion project because that’s the first thing I tell people about podcasting is it’s an expensive hobby. And, you know, I keep seeing all these articles about brands need to be advertising on podcasts.
I’m like, yes, yes, yes. I haven’t seen it yet, but, but yeah, it, it, it’s, it’s one of those things that I love conversation. I, I love the talking. And so, this was like a great way to, instead of doing Facebook ads, you know, get this out here. And, and ideally it was started as a way to get in touch with students…
[00:16:16] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah.
[00:16:16] Matt Bailey: …who took my courses in many different places, but, “Hey, here’s how we can stay in touch.” And that’s how…
[00:16:23] Mary Czarnecki: Yep.
[00:16:23] Matt Bailey: …it started, and it’s just really morphed away from there.
[00:16:26] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah. I, and it’s funny too, ’cause I think that the fact you found a forum, they, a format, you know, medium that you love doing and serves your purpose as the ideal. Right? So, there’s certain people that don’t like talking, right? They love the written word. They love embracing the, the drafting and the redrafting. And I think that’s, that’s the fun thing is that, you know, when, when we started in our careers, if you wanted to have a radio show, you had to have a radio show.
[00:16:56] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:16:57] Mary Czarnecki: Right?
[00:16:57] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:16:57] Mary Czarnecki: You had to be a DJ. You had to get a forum, but now, you know, you want a radio show, you get a podcast, a YouTube channel, a Facebook live show. You can create your own platform, your own stage, and you get to choose the medium, right? If, if you love talking to your friends, you love making videos, there’s that opportunity. And the barrier to entry is really so low.
I know some people I talk to I’m helping kind of get started with building this platform, get very overwhelmed with, “Oh, but do I need the right technology? And do I have the right equipment?” And yeah, you can get all that stuff, but I, I mean, tell me if I’m wrong, but you can start very simply, right? With the stuff that we already have and the power that we have in our phones these days is impressive.
[00:17:43] Matt Bailey: Oh, I, the microphone in my iPhone is better than my first microphone that I started with. I, I am serious. You could put them, your iPhone in the center of a table and two people could talk over it, and the quality will be amazing. Better than my first podcast or series of podcasts, because now, the thing is, you have to figure, then figure out, and, and we’ll, we’ll use podcasting, but this is I think, business in a nutshell. “Do I want to edit these?” Well, you know what? You’re going to have to.
[00:18:16] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah.
[00:18:16] Matt Bailey: Your first couple. It, it, it depends on where you’re at, but it’s the same thing in business. When I’m starting a business, I’m doing what I love. I’m, I’m doing this, but now there are other aspects of the business where I have to do this if I can’t afford to pay someone to do it. And that, I think, is probably the number one struggle of starting a business is there’s 60% of it that you love, 20% that you can do, 20% you will absolutely hate.
[00:18:49] Mary Czarnecki: Yes.
[00:18:50] Matt Bailey: That’s, that’s my best assessment of starting a business.
[00:18:53] Mary Czarnecki: Yes. Yes. I would, I would wholeheartedly agree. Yeah, that moment where I first outsourced those tasks that I didn’t enjoy that didn’t have to have me doing it and I could actually have someone else take that on, that was a happy day.
[00:19:08] Matt Bailey: Right? Right. Absolutely. Absolutely. Because…
[00:19:12] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah.
[00:19:12] Matt Bailey: …now I can focus doing what I want to do, but I, I, I want to ask you, so, let’s say someone’s ready to take that step. And how are you coaching them? Are you coaching them on marketing? Are you coaching them on branding? Are you coaching them on operations? Where, where do you typically start when you talk with someone?
[00:19:33] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah. So, when I, when I talk to someone who’s really looking to jump in and actually create a sustainable business or a sustainable brand for themselves, the first thing we touch on is really, you know, what are the factors that go into being a business owner? ‘Cause for so many of us, myself included, even if we worked and had a successful career or had a great, you know, position in, in a corporate or a larger organization, or even a small business, we never really got to see all of it, right?
[00:20:00] So, there are definitely aspects of it we don’t really know are coming our way. So, to your point about that 20% of things that you’re not good at and you’re not gonna like doing, those were probably things you weren’t hired to do.
[00:20:13] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:20:14] Mary Czarnecki: So, the first conversation is usually just the lay of the land. So, we’re not going to get deep on all of these all at once because you can’t, right? That’s why a company has multiple employees, but if you are doing this solopreneur, scrappy startup style, you at least have to know they exist. Right? So, we talk about, you know, the operations and, you know, all the legal, financial set up.
And then we also talk about the, the marketing stuff, because obviously that’s the, the side that I really enjoy, which is, “Okay, well, what are you producing? Who are you producing it for? Is this something that they’re actually willing to pay to solve?” Right? A problem that they have, that they have, that they’re actually willing to pay to solve, and then delivery. So, it’s a little bit, you know, marketing, a little sales, a little operations, a little delivery, and then, you know, the fuel for the whole plane, right?
But you’re actually thinking about, “Okay, well, how are you going to fund this startup, right? Are we going to do just scrappy startup and we’re going to do a shoestring budget and get some clients in the door first and then go from there, or are we talking about, you know, putting in some owner investment into this to get it going faster?” So, we do cover all of it at first, just to give them a lay of the land, but I think it, for me, I wish someone had done that at the start. Whereas so often, especially you get these webinars and these trainings where they’re like, “Start a business in 30 days and you’ll be up and running and making a million dollars in, you know, three days.”
And I just think that without giving people the perspective of, “Okay, yes, you can a hundred percent start simple, have something launched in a week, but it’s not going to be Spanx.” Right? It’s not going to be this huge operation.
[00:22:02] Matt Bailey: Right. Right.
[00:22:03] Mary Czarnecki: So, I think just giving people that perspective is usually my first step. And then from that, it allows me to figure out, “Okay, where are they going to shine?” ‘Cause like you said, there’s that 60% that you love that you’re good at. “This is where I want to be.” It gives me that idea of, “Okay, here’s where we’re going to keep you for longer. And then these are the areas that we’re going to need to start looking for and figuring out how we’re going to pay for you to outsource.”
[00:22:30] Matt Bailey: That is great. That is great. Yeah. I, same thing. I wish someone had just, you know, I, I feel like it was just a stumbling in the dark when I started. It was just, “I’m going to do what I know I can do, which is get clients. Then I’ll figure out how to service those clients.” And, and right away, I had a friend that was a, a great accountant and, and she is still my accountant after, shoot, 15 years, more?
That was probably one of the best moves I could have ever made, and, because that was a whole side of the world that I had no clue about, nor did I ever want to know. And to this day, I’m not allowed to see what’s in the bank account. I’m not allowed to have a debit card. I’m not, it, it, it’s one of those things where it’s like, I, I’m not allowed to spend any money unless I have permission because they know if I see money in the account, I’m like, “Oh, we can spend it.”
You know, it’s, it’s worth a, I, I’m one of those people that, you know, I’m better left, I’m just better ignorant of that whole side of the world. But on my side, I’ll, I’ll say this. If I had the resources available today, back then, you know, I’m just going through, I’m, I’m thinking about the technology and I’ll, I’ll even say that the cost of the technology is not bad for a startup.
Just this morning I was in Canva. I was in active campaign. I was in, you, you know, a lot of these, I was on YouTube. I, I was in my, in my blog, in my website. I’m like, and, and I’m, I look at that, I’m like the investment in those areas is very, very small, but yet they’re so critical to growing the business.
[00:24:13] Mary Czarnecki: Yep.
[00:24:13] Matt Bailey: And I had none of those. You know, other than WordPress back in the day, but you know, to, to do graphic design 20 years ago, as opposed to, now I will say this, I get into Canva and, and my designer was laughing at me this morning. I, I showed her something I created, and she just gave me this look. And I’m, I’m one of those that I know good design when I see it, but I’m not going to get you there.
[00:24:39] Mary Czarnecki: Right.
[00:24:39] Matt Bailey: And yeah, she gave me a look that, that, and I kept telling her, “That’s why you’re here. Make something better. Make it look nice.” It, it, it’s the resources today are so much greater. There’s so much more that you can use and immediately be up and running.
[00:24:55] Mary Czarnecki: Oh, a hundred percent. Yeah. I mean, even if, you know, going back to your example in the, in the beginning of, even if you’re not really sure how you want to monetize this, how you want to create this, you’re not really looking to create a business. You just know that you want something more than just having to rely on an employer, and you know you have value, you know you have expertise, skills, and experience that could be of value to someone.
Just starting with a presence someplace where you can share your value, continue the conversation, and allow people to give you money, just having a space for those three things to happen, and it all can happen in one place, right? It can all be, you know, a Facebook page. It could all be one simple one page website. It could be a YouTube channel. Right? You get to pick your platform, but really it doesn’t have to be complicated. You just have to have a way to communicate with people, continue the conversation, and allow them to give you money.
[00:25:50] Matt Bailey: Right. That’s a great way of putting it. So, I do a regular class for influencers, people who want to be influencers. And one of the first assignments I give them is go find 20 ways to make money. And that’s your assignment.
[00:26:07] Mary Czarnecki: Yep.
[00:26:07] Matt Bailey: You have to go online, research, “How are people making money?” And, and I think that’s one thing that would certainly help anyone who’s thinking about starting a business is you are not limited to a credit card platform where you have to sell something and get money in return. There are dozens of ways to make money online. And when you start seeing it, when you start pulling it apart. Well, a great example is, is my wife does yoga and it’s funny, ’cause everyone we mention this to, Yoga by Adriene.
[00:26:44] Mary Czarnecki: Oh, yeah.
[00:26:45] Matt Bailey: Exactly. That’s the response we get. Everybody knows her. Everybody knows her, and I think since the pandemic she’s like quadrupled in an audience, but I’m fascinated because she’s got the YouTube channel, but she’s got an app, she has a membership. And from what I understand, she’s made more, she makes more money off that app and the membership than she does from YouTube. And she’s now selling her own branded stuff. And I, I use that as a great example is she used YouTube to create her own thing.
[00:27:18] Mary Czarnecki: Yep.
[00:27:18] Matt Bailey: And now she’s selling on top of that. And that’s the way you need to think, and thinking about, “Well, I’m going to use Instagram and make money,” or, “I’m going to use, you know, YouTube and get a lot of views and make money.” You’re limiting yourself because there’s, there’s 20, 40, 50 ways to make money. You just need to be aware what they are.
[00:27:40] Mary Czarnecki: Oh, a hundred percent. I think that’s a brilliant exercise as the first one, because it opens people’s eyes, I’m sure, to, “Oh, I thought I was playing in this little box and now I’m actually playing on this huge field.” Right? And, and I bet there’s going to be even more things that they’ll come across and be like, “Oh, I didn’t know you could do that.”
So, I love that experience about, you know, the, uh, instructor, just because you hear stories like that, and I know there are certain people I’ve talked to who’ve, you know, come to me and ask these questions. “Well, how do you do this? How do you start this?” You don’t create that overnight.
[00:28:12] Matt Bailey: No.
[00:28:13] Mary Czarnecki: Right? She didn’t have a membership and an app and a YouTube channel come into being in 48 hours. Right?
[00:28:21] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:28:21] Mary Czarnecki: So, I don’t know her exact origin story, but I will bet that, you know, when she launched her YouTube channel, she had certain videos that took off and she had certain videos that bombed. And I think that’s the genius of that approach of whether you’re on YouTube or Facebook or Instagram or Tik Tok, whatever your platform is, you’re doing what professional marketers really do, which is test the content.
What do your people really resonate with? What do they actually want? And then using that knowledge, you can say, “Oh, they want convenience more than price, right? That, they care more about having something on demand than they care about have things something super cheap. Okay. So, they’re willing to pay for a membership. They’re willing to pay for an app. They’re willing to pay for this way.” You know, and then she can also play with, “Well, do I actually like delivering my content in that way?”
[00:29:09] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:29:09] Mary Czarnecki: So, you get to figure out that Venn diagram of, “Okay, I’m now learning that this is what people are willing to pay me for. And this is what I’m learning I actually like to do, I actually like to work with groups,” or, “I like to create content that people consume later,” or, “I like to work with people one-on-one.”
And that match between what you learn people are willing to pay you for, and “Wow, I actually realized that I do, don’t, or kind of like doing it this way,” is where I see those business owners who have created these, these “businesses,” quote, unquote, from scratch and then have succeeded. They’ve mastered that part of it, that transition from learning and listening to our audiences to then actually giving them what they told us they were willing to pay for.
[00:29:58] Matt Bailey: That is such a great observation because, so, I’m trying to think how many episodes ago I had Greg Jarboe who has been sort of like the YouTube guy. He, he wrote the book, it’s already outdated. He wrote another book, it’s already outdated. He wrote an article three months ago and he told me that’s already outdated, but his main point about video marketing and YouTube especially is brands are years behind because brands are afraid to fail.
[00:30:00] Whereas creators, like you said, there, it’s a learning experience that, “Oh, I got a dozen videos that bombed here, but these three are really. And why is it? What is it that people like, what do they don’t like?” You’re learning and adjusting as you go. And he said that is not in a brand DNA, a big brand.
[00:30:46] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah.
[00:30:47] Matt Bailey: A big brand. They don’t want to fail. They don’t want to produce something that’s going to bomb. And a creator is able to connect with that audience faster. And as you said, it, it, it’s learning and listening.
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[00:32:56] Matt Bailey: And I think that’s a valuable lesson that as you’re building a business, as you’re creating it, you can’t be rigid in, “This is how it’s going to be. There, there’s no other way.” If you don’t, if you don’t have that flexibility and learning from your audience, then you’re going to miss a lot of opportunity.
[00:33:13] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah. And I think that that’s one of those things that thinking back, I wish someone had told me. I wish I had someone tell me that your website is not going to look like the employer that you’re currently look like, you know, working for his website. Your product is not going to be as perfectly packaged, delivered, and marketed as much as you want it to be as the products that you’re selling now for someone else.
And I think that transition from employee to entrepreneur, there is that shift in, “It has to be perfect ’cause that’s what I’m being paid for and that’s what I’m measured on. Those are my KPIs from my job,” as opposed to, especially as a startup or a solopreneur, 80% is good enough to go. Right? You just have to let go of perfection. And like you said, be okay with the fail because every fail, every no, every, you know, missed launch is going to be a learning experience because now you know, what’s the, what’s the, uh, quote. “Now I know a thousand different ways not to make a light bulb.”
[00:34:15] Matt Bailey: Right. Oh, yeah.
[00:34:17] Mary Czarnecki: Right?
[00:34:17] Matt Bailey: Brilliant. Brilliant.
[00:34:18] Mary Czarnecki: So, yeah, so I think that, but I see it, I mean, I’m sure maybe you even see it in the classes you teach. ‘Cause I know in addition to being business owners, we’re also educators and trainers, uh, speakers. I see it in the classes and in the workshops that I teach when I have entrepreneurs in the audience versus when I have employees in the audience.
[00:34:36] Matt Bailey: Oh, yeah. Yeah.
[00:34:37] Mary Czarnecki: Right? People are willing to ask the stupid question in my entrepreneur audiences way more often than I’m seeing that happen in the employee audiences, because of that fear of, you know, not showing up in that perfect picture, right? That picture of perfection.
[00:34:53] Matt Bailey: Yeah. Oh, absolutely. I think that’s probably the biggest thing to get over, but absolutely, yeah. Employees, they’re, there is afraid of that, that perception, “I’m afraid of looking stupid,” I, I, anything that would minimize my visibility within an office, that’s an extra pressure, whereas yeah. The entrepreneur audience is, no. “Show me, tell me, I want to know. How do I, how do I make this happen? What’s,” and, and if anything, you get more and more question that, that just, I don’t mind answering, but man, they’re not afraid because your mindset has completely shifted from one of protecting my reputation to, “I’m trying to make money.”
[00:35:34] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah.
[00:35:34] Matt Bailey: “And, and I’m solely responsible for that.” And that is, a, a huge mental shift, oh, away from that.
[00:35:42] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah. I had this poster on my wall when I first started freelancing. I’m trying not to say “side hustle” ’cause I know how much you hate it.
[00:35:50] Matt Bailey: Thank you. Say it.
[00:35:51] Mary Czarnecki: And, uh, and it had this big statement that basically said, “That can’t work,” with a big X through it. And underneath it was kind of scrawled, “How do I make it work?” And for me, that was the reminder of I now no longer have someone coming to me, overseeing me saying, “No, this is how we’ve always done it. This is the way we do it. This is not going to work for us, for our brand, for our company, whatever.” And now it’s up to me to be saying, “Well, how am I going to make this work or not?” But it’s my choice.
[00:36:21] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:36:21] Mary Czarnecki: It’s, I get to decide, okay, great. That topic didn’t work or didn’t fly or wow, I launched a on-demand course and people really came back and they said, “Well, I didn’t want to buy your on-demand course ’cause I want you. I want you actually telling me how to do this,” right? “To make sure that I’m doing it right.” And oh, okay. I thought you wanted this, now you’re telling me you want this. Okay. Yeah, I can do that. Right? So, it’s that whole learning of, okay, how do I make this work? How do I make this work for me and the people that I’m looking to serve?
[00:36:51] Matt Bailey: That is so cool. I, yeah. I, I mean, we are so very different and, and again, it’s the audience that you attract and, and, and it goes back to, you know, when I was in sales, you know, I had a great, great mentor and he always said, “They’re buying you. They’re buying your personality. They’re buying their perception of you. They’re not buying the product.” It’s, it’s, you ask anyone, and, and I, I, years later we did a, uh, survey with a company with their customers and this company, we asked them, “What’s your number one? Why do people buy from you?”
[00:37:24] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah.
[00:37:24] Matt Bailey: And they’re like, “It’s our customer service. We have a great product, it’s the best in the market.” They went down this list. We did the same survey with their clients. Number one response, “Love my sales guy. Love them. They are always there. They’re on the ball. They’re proactive.”
[00:37:41] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah.
[00:37:41] Matt Bailey: And when we shared that with the company, it’s like that thought never crossed their mind.
[00:37:45] Mary Czarnecki: Yep.
[00:37:45] Matt Bailey: They never understood that, and, and I’m trying to show them, whoever’s leading this sales team, you need to reward them because that’s why you’re successful. They’re aggressively proactively communicating and providing information. And so, that it comes back to that learning and listening that you brought up. I think that’s so powerful…
[00:38:05] Mary Czarnecki: Yep.
[00:38:05] Matt Bailey: …of it’s going to be people buy from me because of me. And if I’m not listening to them…
[00:38:11] Mary Czarnecki: Right.
[00:38:11] Matt Bailey: …I could really move off the tracks and not even be the same, I’m not giving them what they want.
[00:38:19] Mary Czarnecki: Well, there’s a, there’s a great story is in one of my classes, and it is a corporate example, but I use it with a lot of my entrepreneurs, which is embracing this power of the pause to actually listen to what they want and really listen to what they want instead of interpreting first.
So, there was a I shall, uh, company shall not be named, uh, understood from their market research that their audience really wanted their products to be more green, more environmentally responsible. And they said, “Okay, great. We are going to go through this entire repackaging effort and put all of our products into this recyclable material.”
And they went through this huge, you know, I mean, you know what that takes. That takes operations changes, manufacturing changes, all of a sudden, you’re doing, I mean, it’s a huge investment and undertaking. And they do this whole launch, obviously then you’ve got more money and energy and resources being dumped into the launch of it. They launch it and sales actually went down.
[00:39:18] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:39:20] Mary Czarnecki: And they said, “Whoa, whoa, whoa. You told us…” Right? They probably went back to their market research team and said, “Whoa, whoa, whoa.”
[00:39:28] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:39:28] Mary Czarnecki: But, “You told us, market, consumers, you wanted a more green product.” And what they found by actually asking them the right questions was, “Yeah. Except now I actually feel less green because you put it into a recycling format that my town doesn’t accept.”
[00:39:49] Matt Bailey: Oh wow.
[00:39:50] Mary Czarnecki: And so, they realized that only a small fraction of the people lived in a geography where they could actually easily recycle the green material product that they had put it into.
[00:40:00] Matt Bailey: Wow. Yeah.
[00:40:05] Mary Czarnecki: And they said, “Oh.”
[00:40:07] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:40:08] Mary Czarnecki: You know, before they could actually, you know, reuse or whatever, the other, the other kind of material and they said, “Oh, well, but do you still want a green product?” And they said yes. And so, they figured out after much trial and error that what they had to do is they actually just changed some things in their manufacturing plant to reduce waste, reduce water usage, reduce runoff, and you know, not to be glib, but plant some wildflowers, you know, to work on the riparian area, right?
So, and then donate to some foundations and things like that and showcase, you know, “Okay, well, you know, we’re actually putting your money, your investment in our products into good, good works.”
[00:40:47] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:40:48] Mary Czarnecki: And that made a bigger impression.
[00:40:50] Matt Bailey: Huh.
[00:40:51] Mary Czarnecki: That meant an increase in revenue.
[00:40:53] Matt Bailey: That is cool. And, and it’s such a, yeah, I, I love that example. I really do because we’re doing what people want, but not being aware of what the capabilities are on the other side. That is amazing. Amazing. It, it kind of makes me, it makes me think of, and, and you, I’m sure you’ve experienced this before. Years ago, I would sit down, and I would write a blog post. And like you said, I would do the rewrite. I’d do the edit. I, I’m, you know, I’m, I’m putting hours into this blog post. I’m like, “This is going to be amazing.”
Crickets. Nothing happens. And, and this happened when I was on Twitter, too. You, you know, 140 characters, I probably spent 2 hours, you, you know, “Am I using the right word?” Nothing. I get emotional about something, I see something, I make an offhanded comment on Twitter, or I make a quick blog post, readership, you know, views, everything goes through the roof and, and you’re sitting there going, “What is, what’s going on here? What is this?”
And, and it’s, I see that so much. And again, that gets back to that flexibility of I’m producing this ’cause I think it’s going to be awesome, but you know what? It’s awesome for me. It’s what I think is going to happen, and, and there might be a good word, you know, a few things there, but that spur of the moment, just why does that take off? What is it that makes that happen? And I think it’s more, I’m capturing the emotion. I’m capturing the, the feeling that someone has and, and they’re moving along with it.
And again, it’s just, it’s a digital form I think of maybe reading the room of what’s going on. That, if there’s any advice I would make to people is, yeah. You’d have things that flop and things that you invest hours in, time, money, hours are going to flop. And then you’re going to do something that you didn’t even think twice about and it’s going to go crazy. Be ready for that.
[00:42:47] Mary Czarnecki: Yes. A hundred percent.
[00:42:49] Matt Bailey: I, I, it’s a phenomenon that I just can’t explain. Now, do I turn my whole business into like, just doing spur of the moment type stuff? You know, there’s a danger to that.
[00:43:04] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah. And I think that, you know, people always say, “Oh, well you can’t predict virality or you can’t predict what’s going to, what’s going to pop.” And on one hand, no, you, you can’t predict, you know, the flukes, right? The, the one-offs. But I do think that that listening part, you know, like, so for example, like the, the product example, the product company, asking the question not just, “What do you want?” but, “Okay. You want a green product. What does that mean to you?” Right?
So, you may create content that you love and that you’re, you’re, you, you know that because your audience is like you, “Oh, of course they’re going to love it. This is going to be great. I’m going to invest all this time and energy and effort,” and it does flop and you’re like, “Oh, okay. Well, was there a segment of the, you know, group that really did like it, but the vast majority didn’t?” Then you know that, well, you may have more in common with that small percentage of your audience, right? Than the vast majority.
And that’s okay. ‘Cause I think that, you know, it’s not that you never have to, or that you never can create content that only you enjoy, like you said, right? They, there’s going to be content that you just really need to put out in order to stay excited about your business. And I think that has total validity, but also that idea of, you know, sometimes don’t be afraid to pull the trigger on putting out, like you said, the content where you’re just in the moment and you’re feeling the vibe and you’re like, “I can’t say this. Maybe I shouldn’t say this. Well, I want to say this, but no, I don’t want to say this. Well, what is it going to look like? Well, do I need to format it?” Right? If you’re finding yourself going back and forth in that inner monologue, that’s when you know you have to publish it.
[00:44:44] Matt Bailey: That is, oh my goodness. Where were you yesterday? Yeah, I, I published, I put something on LinkedIn about, you know, Google getting sued, you know, it’s Tuesday. Google must be getting sued somewhere. And, and it was, it was this like, “How do I say that?” You know, I don’t want to come across as anti-Google, which well, you know, there is, but yeah, it’s, it’s that back and forth.
And I like what you said. It has to be said. Um, but yet, if I were to put together a 500-page article expressing my true feelings and everything, probably wouldn’t go, but it’s, it’s that, but I love what you said that, but there are times where I do need to do that in order to keep my excitement about the business.
That was, that was amazing, Mary. That, that, that really does explain, I think, that need we have of, “I want to do this, even though it’s not gonna get popular or get a lot of views, it’s for me and it’s necessary.” That, wow.
[00:45:41] Mary Czarnecki: Well, because if you don’t stay excited about it, you’re not going to, getting back to that question of the why, right? You’re not gonna get through the harder days. You’re not going to get through the lean times. Right? So, I think we do have to go, and you never know. And that’s why I also believe, you know, we talked at the beginning, you know, which platform do you choose? Which technology? Do you need all the things? No, you definitely don’t need all the things.
But I do firmly believe in this day and age where you’ve got platforms that disappear so quickly, I mean, Twitter’s great. Yes. You can go back and look at what people posted, but really, if you’re not catching it right in that moment, it’s, it’s gone.
[00:46:14] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:46:15] Mary Czarnecki: And, you know, things where the, you know, like Instagram Stories, where it disappeared. I think those are great. But I also think that having a platform, at least one where the content is evergreen, is ever present, is ever available, which is one of the reasons I love having a podcast, having a YouTube channel, is you’re creating that content, right? We’re talking about the one where, “Okay. This might not go viral, you know, viral, but it’s content that I know has value because I’ve walked the walk, I’ve talked the talk, I’ve talked to the people, I’ve seen it provide value and it lights me up.”
And providing that content over there allows people to, when they do get introduced or find you through those, you know, the shiny, you know, engaging, exciting pieces of content, a lot of times they want to really see what more you’re about. And I think that having that treasure trove of content where people then can go and figure out, “Well, who are you and what do you, what else do you know? What else can you share with me?” And I see a lot of value in that. It may not be the most, you know, sexy, exciting kind of value where people are like, “Oh my God, did you see, I got 2 million views on my, you know, YouTube video?”
Well, no, but I’ve also had people, I’ve been booked for keynote speaking engagements because people were like, “Oh, well, I saw that, you know, the, the viral video or the one that everyone talks about, but then I went and then I watched some of your other videos, right? And that’s where I got to feel who you really are. And I really feel like I got to know you.”
[00:47:48] Matt Bailey: Very, very true. And I think you make a great, great point about choosing a channel or choosing where you’re going to focus. And, and one of the things that I’ve been really working with people on is find something that you own rather than, you know, all these platforms like Instagram, Facebook, YouTube to an extent, LinkedIn has become this.
They are growing because of your content. And once you upload something to especially Instagram, Snapchat, Facebook, any of them, they own it. And they’re going to use it to keep people on their platform. And if you upload content that has a link back to your site or to something that’s outside the platform, it’s not going to get the visibility because their, their goal is to keep people on the platform, on the channel.
And so, I, I’m challenging people that, yeah, you do stuff on Instagram, you’re going to get a big following, but ultimately Instagram is using your content to build their channel, to build their presence and they could change their policies tomorrow. What are you doing to build you that you own? That it doesn’t matter if policies change. Here’s my stuff. And you know, like, I, I think YouTube is probably a little safe.
I, I love the whole podcast thing, even though it’s hosted at a third party, it’s still mine. I do what I want with it. I can, I can make it a 10-minute show if I want. I can do, you know, but I own it because it’s my content. I own it. And I, and I think that’s, that’s something to think about, especially starting a business and choosing, “Where am I going to focus my time, effort and money?” Make sure that it’s something that ties back to something you own so that you’re not being moved around by the market forces or the decisions that another platform makes about their profitability.
[00:49:51] Mary Czarnecki: Oh, a hundred percent. Yeah. I, I don’t think that anyone starting a business today, even if it’s just, you know, personal brand that you don’t know how you’re going to monetize yet, having that control of the conversation versus just being on a, like you said, on a platform that does not have your best interest in mind is very risky, right?
[00:50:00] You don’t know when your profile is going to shut down, when they’re going to change their algorithm, when they’re going to change their priorities, like you said, those are great, you know, kind of speakerphone channels because anytime you’re trying to sell something, you either have to create your own audience or you go where the audience is, right? So, you’re going where your audience is. And those channels are saying, “Hey, you know, if you’re going to help us out by creating great content, improving our platform, we’re going to show your content to these people.” But you do have to recognize that, that it is a partnership, right? They’re not in it for you and your brand…
[00:50:49] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:50:49] Mary Czarnecki: …and your business. And so, like you said, you have to then, once you connect with the people in those channels, bring them into something that…
[00:50:59] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:50:59] Mary Czarnecki: …you control the conversation.
[00:51:00] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:51:01] Mary Czarnecki: Right? So, when I, one of the things I, I walk through with a lot of people that are getting started building this platform is how to create one piece of content and then repurpose it. Because usually when people are getting started, they’re still doing a full-time job or they’ve got other responsibilities, so they’re overwhelmed by the thought of, “How do I create content for even just 3 channels?” And we talk about how to take one piece and repurpose it.
But I always focus on making sure that whatever we’re doing, whatever we’re sharing, whatever we’re promoting, it’s bringing them back. It’s introducing them to an opportunity to engage in something that you’re offering where you own it. Right? So, like you said, yes, your podcast is hosted on a platform, but the content you own, right? You have the video, you have the audio, you have your blog posts.
Hopefully if you’re promoting something on, on, you know, social media channels, I tell my clients this all the time, I’m like, “Well, have you saved those images? Have you saved that copy or did you just type it into the channel and then forget about it?” Because all of that rich text is all copy that you can then own and repurpose. But if you’re only putting it in that library, that that platform owns, good luck trying to find it if they decide to change course.
[00:52:15] Matt Bailey: That’s a great point.
[00:52:17] Mary Czarnecki: Right? And also, good luck trying to find your people. So, that’s why I love the idea of having an email list. I mean, you mentioned active campaign before, but there are so many options now with email. There’s, I, I use active campaign. I used to use ConvertKit. I know people that use a variety of different tools, but having that ability to proactively reach out to people instead of reactively say, “Hey, I’m over here on this channel, come watch my video.” Right? It’s, it’s kind of like going to a conference and handing out a hundred business cards and then getting home and saying, “Well, now I just have to wait for people to call me.”
[00:52:54] Matt Bailey: Right. Right. No, I think you make a great, great point, and what you’re doing, and, and I love it. It’s, I’m seeing like Instagram, Snap, whatever, Tik Tok, they’re recruiting channels is what they are. They’re not the end of publishing. It’s the beginning of recruiting an audience to come to my space.
[00:53:15] Mary Czarnecki: Right.
[00:53:16] Matt Bailey: Agh. I mean, coming to the one that I own not to the Myspace branded, I said that completely wrong. I love it. Yeah. I’m, I’m using them, I’m, I’m prospecting audience on that platform or as I like to say, use them just like they’re using you.
[00:53:32] Mary Czarnecki: Yes.
[00:53:32] Matt Bailey: They’re using you to grow their audience. Use them to grow your audience in a place that you own. My space.
[00:53:41] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah. And I mean, I know we, we’ve already had like a whole episode on customer journey, but again, you know, just, it, it relates back to that, right?
[00:53:49] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:53:49] Mary Czarnecki: What channels are you using as your attraction mechanism, your nurture mechanism, and then your loyalty mechanisms? Because they’re not the same.
[00:53:57] Matt Bailey: No. No. No, they’re not, even though they’re all trying to be the same right now.
[00:54:03] Mary Czarnecki: Yes.
[00:54:04] Matt Bailey: Um, I feel like every headline every day is how someone’s adding a feature to compete with Tik Tok and Tik Tok’s doing this now and, and…
[00:54:12] Mary Czarnecki: Right.
[00:54:13] Matt Bailey: I’m like, they are, where are the distinctives? They’re disappearing.
[00:54:18] Mary Czarnecki: I know. It’s, it’s like being a specialist is a bad word, right?
[00:54:21] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:54:21] Mary Czarnecki: So…
[00:54:22] Matt Bailey: Yeah. I, I mean like Twitter. Yeah. It used to be 140 characters. Well, now it’s images, video, and I’m, so what, what’s different about it? I think, really, it’s going to end up being a completely demographic difference.
[00:54:34] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah.
[00:54:34] Matt Bailey: That’s really going to be the only distinguishing factor among these…
[00:54:38] Mary Czarnecki: Yep.
[00:54:38] Matt Bailey: …of that, you, you know, you’ve got your, I would say your, your technology savvy political audiences on Twitter. Your technology, not as savvy political audiences on, older audiences on Facebook. Your, you know, millennials are on Instagram here. It, it, it, what generation do you want to reach? Because that’s the platform you’re going to go after. I feel like that’s where it’s going.
[00:55:03] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah.
[00:55:03] Matt Bailey: And then you’re going to get tossed off a platform if you don’t fit the demographic.
[00:55:08] Mary Czarnecki: Yes.
[00:55:12] Matt Bailey: Yeah. The distinctives are just completely falling apart. Oh my. So, alright. We are, I, I can’t believe, Mary, it is so fun talking with you. I can’t believe how much time flies. We have not, and that’s the thing. You, you’ve been doing a little bit of travel, but I mean, the conference thing is like kind of slow down again. So, it’s a, it’s a little odd. Good to see you, though. I, I can’t believe…
[00:55:34] Mary Czarnecki: Good to see you, too. Thanks for having me on today.
[00:55:36] Matt Bailey: Oh, thank you. I, this has been a great, great conversation. I have learned a few things from your observations. It’s, it’s just been a great, great talk. And, and Mary, what advice, like, I mean, we’ve gone over all of this, but how would you wrap up someone who’s, who’s considering taking that step and starting something on their own. How, how would you kind of wrap this up in a, in a neat little bow?
[00:56:01] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah, for sure. I’d, I’d encourage them to think about three things. Number one, why are you doing this? Is this something that you want to make money at? Is it something you want to replace your income with? Is it something you’re not even sure how you want to make money with yet, but you know that you have value that you can create a platform around? So, that question of just getting clear for yourself, you don’t even have to share it with anyone. You don’t even have to post it anywhere, but just that clarity around why am I doing this? What do I want out of it?
And then jump in, right? Jump in, get started with one platform. Pick something that you like to do, because you may not know what your audience wants yet, and that’s fine, right? If you like blogging, blog. If you like podcasting, podcast. If you like making videos, make videos. But do it. Just jump in.
And then the third one, you know, mildly self-serving, but you know, get a support network, right? Whether it’s a mentor, a friend, a coach, an instructor, take a course, people have done this already. Learn from those who’ve gone before, learn from their mistakes, and, and also even if it’s just a support network, not necessarily an advisory kind of network, talking to people who are doing the same thing as you makes you feel a little less isolated and a little less, “Oh, no one else is doing this. Maybe I’m a little crazy.”
[00:57:28] Matt Bailey: No, that, oh my goodness, Mary, I can’t believe we’re just getting to that now.
[00:57:32] Mary Czarnecki: Yeah.
[00:57:32] Matt Bailey: That is, oh my goodness, yes.
[00:57:35] Mary Czarnecki: That’ll be part two.
[00:57:37] Matt Bailey: Yeah. I, I, the value, so I, one of my upcoming podcasts, I am talking with the CEO of LeTip and how valuable networking and networking with other business owners, networking with other people is not just to your mental health, but to your business. Because I, I, I think I’ve shared this before that, you know, as a, as a younger small business owner, when I, someone I respected shared that, like, one of the things they struggle with is payroll, it, it just like, all of a sudden this burden left, it was like, “I’m not the only one. Oh.” And the more I talk to other business owners, the more I worked with them, I was like, “Oh, okay. This is a struggle for everybody.”
[00:58:21] Mary Czarnecki: Yep.
[00:58:22] Matt Bailey: And, and I didn’t feel so bad anymore. It, it was just, you realize, like you said, you’re not alone and developing these support mentors, I, I, my support network is, you, you know, my accountant. And then I, one of the best things I did was sit with my accountant and ask, “Who are your other clients? Do, are they in any areas that I need? And would you recommend them?”
And, and so, that’s enabled me to find other businesses that I could partner with, learn from, and then also just being aware. One thing I love about networking and with the pandemic, where you’re at, it probably, you know, it’s going to depend, but, you know, finding designers, finding people who can fix your printer, finding people who can do those little things, because I will say the one thing I learned, probably the one lesson I learned the most as a, as a new business owner is that when it came to doing something where it was choice of, do I do this or do I pay someone to do it? That was hard because to pay someone to do it, I don’t want to let go of that money.
[00:59:33] Mary Czarnecki: A hundred percent.
[00:59:34] Matt Bailey: However, it would take me six hours to do it. And if I’d have paid them, I, my time was worth more to focus on what I do that makes money rather than paying someone to do it. And that was one lesson that I have learned now that it’s better to pay someone who can do it in half an hour, than for me to struggle through six hours. And it may hurt, but it’s going to be done right. That was probably the biggest essay.
[01:00:00] Mary Czarnecki: A hundred percent.
[01:00:02] Matt Bailey: That’s the value of a support network.
[01:00:05] Mary Czarnecki: Yes. Yeah. But we, we could talk a whole, another hour about networking and who to pick first for your team.
[01:00:12] Matt Bailey: We’ll do that. You are on the list, Mary. Hey, thank you so much for your time today.
[01:00:18] Mary Czarnecki: A hundred percent. I really enjoyed it. Thanks again, Matt. Always so fun to talk with you.
[01:00:21] Matt Bailey: Same here, Mary. I really enjoyed it as well, and listener, I hope you had a great time as well, and if you’re considering making this move, hey, you know what? Don’t be afraid. Reach out to me or Mary. We’ll both be more than happy to give you a little bit of advice beyond what you’ve heard here, and we wish you the best because it’s a very rewarding move.
[01:00:41] Mary Czarnecki: A hundred percent.
[01:00:42] Matt Bailey: So, yeah. Thank you, Mary. Dear listener, have a great day and we’ll see you again on the next episode of the Endless Coffee Cup podcast.
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