[00:00:00] Izzy House: Well, it, it tells us we can be better. You know, that we can reach great heights if we try. That we can succeed in, in conquering the impossible, because make no mistake, space is hard. It, it, it can kill you in an instant. It is not an easy thing to get through, to, to break through gravity. So, it is hard, but that’s one of the reasons why we love it so much. And because we have in us the need to try to do something hard and to try to be better. And, and I think space encapsulates that feeling of being the best we can be.
[00:00:52] Matt Bailey: Well, hello, dear listener, and thank you for tuning in to another edition of the Endless Coffee Cup podcast. And today I have a fascinating guest. I am very excited about this. It, it, I, I am going to introduce to you Izzy House. Actually, I’m going to let Izzy, if you could just take a few minutes and introduce yourself because I, I’m excited to have you here, but I think from your mouth, I think this would be a fantastic introduction.
[00:01:21] Izzy House: Well, thank you for having me. And who am I? I am a professed space nerd. I love space. I always have loved space ever since I was 13 years old and was introduced with my grandparents. They lived near Cape Canaveral at the time, but, you know, as a good little girl, you know, you get grounded, you pick careers that are not crazy out of this world. And I did, I chose marketing and I loved marketing.
I was in marketing working with small businesses since 1990s. It was truly a happy place. And then my son got to close, he, he started to get close to graduation and I started thinking, “What does chapter three look like for me?” And then I went back to school because during the smartphone revolution, everything changed, marketing changed drastically.
[00:02:23] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:02:24] Izzy House: And it was turned on its head. I went back to school to get up on all of the new techniques and strategies and, and whatnot. And during this time, I went back to Cape Canaveral and then I realized I could combine both my passions and never look back.
[00:02:43] Matt Bailey: Very cool.
[00:02:44] Izzy House: And I wrote a book, and it is called “Space Marketing, Competing in the New Space, in the New Commercial Space Industry.” And I am having a blast and I meant that pun.
[00:02:58] Matt Bailey: Well, that is obvious. I mean, just from the, the conversation that we’ve had already, it, you are so excited about this. And I felt like when, just when we were talking, I’m getting excited. You, it’s just infectious the way that you talk about what’s happening and, and, and this, you know, this new frontier of space and the commercialization of space. And, of course, if it’s being commercialized, if it’s being utilized, it’s got to be marketed.
And so, yeah, you mentioned you, you wrote the book, “Space Marketing,” and also started a podcast, “Space Marketing,” but I had to get you, and, and just, dear listener, just a little bit of context. I met Izzy through the Marketing Podcast Network, which you hear the promos for that every once in a while. And Izzy joined us just a few weeks ago and so, it was very quickly I got in touch and said, “You’ve got to be on the podcast. I, I want to know more about what you’re doing.” So, let me just start with an obvious question, Izzy. How do you market space? And just for the listener, we’re not talking about like small spaces or storage spaces. We’re talking about outer space and that I, I, so, maybe that was obvious, but how do you market space?
[00:04:16] Izzy House: Well, the premise for the book was it, it started way back when I started working with small businesses very early in my career. I was in an environmental technology incubator. I was surrounded by geniuses that they figure that with their inventions, the world would come to them. That they did not need marketing. And I watched a lot of very incredible inventions that could benefit our, our world sit and die on a shelf.
[00:04:52] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:04:52] Izzy House: Because nobody, nobody can buy your product, nobody can buy your idea, nobody can do anything for you if they don’t know you exist.
[00:05:05] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:05:06] Izzy House: And marketing makes you exist. Well, come back into the space industry and commercialization is relatively new. About 2015, the Space Act came in and that really made the commercialization explode. A lot of these people that have been in the space industry for a long time, they’re geniuses, just like that incubator, those same type of people that just, their minds are incredible. But they haven’t had to market. And it has been a very grant-based industry for such a long time that having competition and having to market is kind of uncharted waters.
So, I wrote the book to talk to them and to kind of introduce them to the principles, the tactics, and the, the strategies of marketing is basically just good marketing. It’s building relationships, it’s, “What is branding?” It’s the basics. And it’s good for any business, not just space business, but it’s written through the lens of space so that they can see how it applies to them.
And I took a, a fake company, “Rockets R Us,” and if there’s one out there that exists, I don’t know you exist. And then I applied all the strategies and tactics that I was talking about to that company so they could see how it works. Not just say, “Oh, you need to do this.” You know, this is how you do it. So, and I have a, a very soft spot for education. Education, it is just, I think is the most important thing I can give and that’s what I give in this book.
[00:06:58] Matt Bailey: Wow. That is great. I mean, you, you just dropped a couple of statistics when we were talking about, over 70 countries right now are involved in space in some form or another. You know, I, I, the listeners know I do a lot of work with the United Arab Emirates and, and they sent a probe to Mars. And it’s interesting because the, the whole country celebrates that. That, that is such an achievement, and yet it’s, other countries are jumping on board, as well. So, it’s, it’s interplanetary exploration, it’s moving on, and I think you were talking about just the number of space stations that are…
[00:07:37] Izzy House: Yes.
[00:07:37] Matt Bailey: …coming online. I had no clue about any of that.
[00:07:41] Izzy House: Well, it’s, space is very exciting and a lot of countries are starting space programs, including Africa and countries you wouldn’t, Ecuador, all these other countries that you don’t think of when you think of space. India. India has gone bonkers in space, and they are taking a hold in, in, in, they’re really, really improving on their space. The lower earth orbit has grown immensely. You, the, I went to the space transportation conference this last spring, and they have 107,000 satellites planned to go up…
[00:08:23] Matt Bailey: Planned to go…
[00:08:24] Izzy House: …just this year.
[00:08:25] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:08:26] Izzy House: Just this year. And there, a lot of them are small satellites. We, we’re not talking about bus size satellites here. But we do have a few that are very important. There are 4 going up that are going to be adding to the measurements of our global environment. They’re going to be doing additional measurements. We have several satellites up in orbit that are looking at our earth and seeing how healthy we are, seeing the damage that we’ve done, and it’s through the eyes in space that we’re able to see the damage and correct it.
For example, the hole in the ozone, you know, we heard about the hole in the ozone back many years ago, and because we were able to see it from space, we were able to change legislation, and now that ozone, those holes, we have 2 of them, those holes are healing.
[00:09:22] Matt Bailey: Wow. Wow.
[00:09:23] Izzy House: Because we saw them. If we did not have eyes in space, we would not have known. So, there’s 4 major ones going up to help us see more of what the earth is doing as far as health. Those are important. The space stations, those are exciting. NASA has just signed 3 agreements for new space stations that are going to be going up, I believe it’s 2024 to 2027 roughly, and then they are going to give a fourth, they have a fourth one that is taking over the space station, it’s Axiom, and they’re going to be commercializing the space station. And as soon as they decommission the space station, it is going to be a, its own free flyer. So, a free flyer is just, it’s a space station that’s on its own.
[00:10:00] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:10:15] Izzy House: That’s just NASA. Now, we have another one that is going to be doing a movie with Tom Cruise up there, and it is also set to launch 2025, 24, 25, 20, to 27, somewhere around there. And it’s going to have all kinds of sports themes to it, as well as the entertainment. And there’s another one that is scheduled to go up about the same time that is going to be geared towards hotels. It’s going to…
[00:10:47] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:10:47] Izzy House: …be a space hotel. Space tourism, you know, a lot of people say, “Well, it’s the playground to the rich.” But you could actually say that about aviation when it first started, too.
[00:11:00] Matt Bailey: True, yeah.
[00:11:00] Izzy House: Commercial aviation.
[00:11:01] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:11:02] Izzy House: You know, they would give caviar to the people that were on the flight and really extravagant meals. And it is those beginning, those people that are paying our way for one day, we’ll all be able to do that without even thinking about it. The, one of the most exciting things that is getting ready to happen is subsonic sup-, sub-orbital flight. It is a plane that is going to ride the orbit, the lower earth orbit, which will enable it to go about 14,000 or 17,500 miles per hour.
[00:11:45] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:11:46] Izzy House: And it will be able to travel anywhere in the world in less than 2 hours.
[00:11:51] Matt Bailey: That’s amazing. That, that, I mean, this, this is the type, I, I, I’m not reading about this technology anywhere, you know, as what’s going on and all that so it’s, it’s just so fascinating to hear that yes, there is innovation. There, there are things being developed and, and that’s, that’s exciting because I do a lot of travel. So, that, that, that, I hope to see that in, in, in my lifetime that we’ll be able to experience that, but it’s just fascinating.
[00:12:17] Izzy House: In the next couple years.
[00:12:19] Matt Bailey: Really?
[00:12:19] Izzy House: That’s, that’s the next couple years. United has already ordered some.
[00:12:23] Matt Bailey: Oh really?
[00:12:24] Izzy House: United Airlines.
[00:12:24] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:12:25] Izzy House: The, China has developed them, NASA’s developing them, we’re getting ready to see those come online very quickly.
[00:12:33] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:12:33] Izzy House: Which is one of the reasons why I’m so focused on space ports is because that is your point-to-point transportation. It’s your connection with all these planes. It’s also our connection with space. So, whether or not a space station launches rockets or horizontal takeoffs, which we can talk about, it is still going to be a symbol of space for whatever region, country, state that it’s in. And it will be the hub of all the space activity that’s going on.
[00:13:07] Matt Bailey: That’s amazing. So, yeah, you are currently working with the state of Kentucky and in their transportation cabinet, and you are developing or working to develop the space port there in Kentucky. Talk a little bit more about what a space port is because I, you know, in my mind, I’m thinking, “It’s horizontal launches. It’s, it,” you know. But the way you started to explain it is there’s a lot more going on than that.
I was trying to explain it to my wife the other night. I’m like, “You’re just going to have to listen to the podcast because I, I don’t know enough to answer this question.” So, I’m going to pitch it to you. What exactly is a space port, because you even made the, the comment that at least every state is going to need to have a space port.
[00:13:49] Izzy House: Yes.
[00:13:49] Matt Bailey: And, and that has, has stuck with me. So, what is a space port?
[00:13:54] Izzy House: It, in my opinion, and in my vision, it is the hub of space for the state. There are different kinds of takeoffs, most of our space ports right now, when we think of space ports, we think of vertical. You know, we think of the Falcon 9, we think of the rockets that go up, but there are a lot of space ports that can’t do rockets. It’s literally a bomb so we don’t want it near people, right?
[00:14:24] Matt Bailey: Right. Yeah.
[00:14:25] Izzy House: So, it has to be usually over water. The FAA wants you to keep it safe and so it has to be over water and there’s all kinds of criteria to do vertical launch, but there are a lot of things coming online that are horizontal launch. For example, Virgin Orbit, they are, I think this month they are launching a big rocket. It is basically a plane, like a 747 I believe, or some type of plane like that with a rocket on their wing.
[00:15:01] Matt Bailey: Oh wow.
[00:15:02] Izzy House: It’s, it’s on, below their wing and they get up to a certain altitude and they shoot off the rocket. Well, you end up with less fuel emitted, so it’s kinder. It’s a, it’s a better launch. You don’t have to have as much power. It can carry small satellites, which, you know, satellites can literally fit in your hand now and, which is incredible. And Kentucky has a college that special, specialize, specializes in small satellite development.
[00:15:35] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:15:35] Izzy House: Which you wouldn’t know about.
[00:15:37] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:15:38] Izzy House: Because no, you know, this is just, there’s too many kept secrets in this particular, you know, that it’s, it’s marketing.
[00:15:47] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:15:48] Izzy House: It needs more marketing. And that is one version of horizontal takeoff. Then you have the sub-orbital that is going to need places to land and places to take off. But even if you don’t do any launches whatsoever, then you still have all this technology, all this innovation that needs a place to reside. It needs a place to focus. So, my vision is to have this space port in Eastern Kentucky. Eastern Kentucky recently lost the coal industry and there’s not a lot of, it’s, there’s a huge vacuum right there…
[00:16:28] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:16:28] Izzy House: …as far as what is available for the economy. So, having space go in there could give inspiration to the, the citizens that live there, the community, it could give money and finance and careers and workforce. It can develop all those wonderful things for that end of the state. Whether or not they launch…
[00:16:59] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:17:00] Izzy House: …that’s, that’s a secondary, because some of this technology is mind-blowing. And I know that we talked a little bit about it and I, I want to share it again because it’s just so mind-blowing.
[00:17:11] Matt Bailey: Well, it, yeah.
[00:17:12] Izzy House: Outside of Louisville, they have, there’s a company that is 3D printing hearts.
[00:17:20] Matt Bailey: That’s amazing.
[00:17:21] Izzy House: And it beats. Now, here’s the big deal about that is that when you 3D print something, when you’re working with the cellular structure of, of tissue, it’s like printing with water and it collapses on itself. But when you do it on, in space, it doesn’t do that. And you’re able to 3D print a heart. Now, imagine one day that you, if you need a heart transplant, that you can have a 3D printed heart using your cellular structure, which your body will not reject.
[00:18:03] Matt Bailey: That’s amazing.
[00:18:04] Izzy House: And it’s just amazing.
[00:18:06] Matt Bailey: That is amazing. You, and, and it’s funny because I remember, I mean, when I was a kid, I was reading a book about space and one of the things that always stuck with me, ’cause, you know, I’m kind of right up the road from you in Northeast Ohio where, you know, we had the steel industry and that’s kind of gone away. But in this book, it talked about soon, and, and soon, I think this was like the 80s.
It was like, there will be manufacturing in space because when the steel cools down, because of gravity, it doesn’t, this, the structure, the, the atomic structure or, I’m trying to think exactly what is, the grain is not true. Because of gravity it cools unevenly and…
[00:18:49] Izzy House: Yes.
[00:18:49] Matt Bailey: …heavy particles sink to the bottom. And so, because of that, they were saying if you move your steel production facility into space, then because of zero gravity you have stronger steel, it makes moving it easier as you’re producing it, and, and I just remember the picture of it, of like this hot part of steel going across space. But there’s so much, I mean, to that zero gravity that in a lot of industries, that becomes a very important part of production.
[00:19:19] Izzy House: Yes. And for, for example, 3D printing, they didn’t see 3D printing coming when they talked about the different changes in the steel.
[00:19:28] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:19:28] Izzy House: And 3D printing is being tested on the ISS big time as far as with metals. In fact, in Northern Kentucky, Southern Ohio, they 3D print jet engines and it replaces 300 parts.
[00:19:46] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:20:00] Izzy House: And that, the, they’re able to structure it to where it’s stronger, it’s lighter, and they’re taking that technology and taking it to space. The, the proteins and crystals work differently up there. They’re bigger and cleaner. They’re able to do fiber optics up in space cleaner and better than they could do down here. Made in Space is a company that actually is producing that right now, but…
[00:20:15] Matt Bailey: I’ll have to look for the label.
[00:20:18] Izzy House: …with all that technology…
[00:20:18] Matt Bailey: Yeah. Look for the label “Made in Space.” I mean…
[00:20:21] Izzy House: Yes.
[00:20:21] Matt Bailey: …so already, I mean, we’ve just talked about so many industries just in this short amount of time. Hotels, travel, you know, medical, steel, 3D printing, all the, I mean, how many industries are going to be affected by production or something to do with space over the next few years?
[00:20:42] Izzy House: Well, I even have a better question for you.
[00:20:43] Matt Bailey: Oh, great.
[00:20:44] Izzy House: How many are affected right now?
[00:20:46] Matt Bailey: Oh, you’re going to…
[00:20:48] Izzy House: Yes.
[00:20:48] Matt Bailey: …have to answer that. I can’t.
[00:20:50] Izzy House: Well, that, this is, this is one of my things is that our, space impacts every minute of our day right now. For example, your cell phone that you hold in your pocket. The, it’s coming from space.
[00:21:03] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:21:03] Izzy House: It’s coming from satellites.
[00:21:04] Matt Bailey: Right. Yeah.
[00:21:05] Izzy House: And, and we know this, but sometimes we forget.
[00:21:08] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:21:09] Izzy House: The GPS is coming from space that tells us where to go. What traffic is doing. The GPS is so fine-tuned now that it can detect an inch movement in soil so it can predict earthquakes.
[00:21:25] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:21:25] Izzy House: And that’s coming from space.
[00:21:27] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:21:28] Izzy House: Medicine. Did, did you get the COVID vaccine? Well, guess what? That technology was developed on the international space station.
[00:21:37] Matt Bailey: No, that, that’s crazy. Wow.
[00:21:39] Izzy House: Are, if you’re a diabetic and you take your blood sugar, that was developed so that they could track the astronaut’s blood sugar. That was technology developed in space that came down. Sleep on a Tempur-Pedic memory foam? That was developed for space.
[00:22:02] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:22:02] Izzy House: It’s something called a spinoff technology. So, NASA, because they’re a government entity, they are able to take the, the, the things that they discover, the technology that they develop and give it to the American people. And businesses are able to take that technology and make it into products that we live with every day.
[00:22:23] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:22:25] Izzy House: So, I mean, food preservation came from the Apollo era with Nestle developing how to package foods to where they wouldn’t make you sick. So, there’s a lot of technology just in that application…
[00:22:39] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:22:40] Izzy House: …that we, we lived with every, all, all day long. But we just don’t realize that connection to space.
[00:22:46] Matt Bailey: Very true. Yeah. That’s very true. Wow. Yeah. It’s absolutely astounding to learn this and, and then, you know, learn what else is coming online. I, I think, you know, honestly, you know, I don’t, ’cause, you know, maybe I’m the average person, but it’s like, this is why I guess you are doing what you’re doing.
You are marketing, you are raising awareness, which is what marketing does include, of, you know, just an appreciation of what’s going on but also, I mean, this is going to be a major, major factor. And, and, you know, I’m just thinking of just like hiring, you know, hiring people. What kind of experience they have in understanding this “space?” How are they going to talk about it, present it? But then, you know, then we get into all kinds of supply chain things that’s going on, as well. This is just an incredible industry that it, it seems like it’s going to be turning everything upside down over the next decade. I mean, is that…
[00:23:42] Izzy House: Absolutely,
[00:23:42] Matt Bailey: Really?
[00:23:44] Izzy House: I mean, and we’re getting ready to go back to the moon, and when we go back to the moon, we’re going to stay. They’re building, they’re going to have a gateway, which is another space station that’s going up and it’s going to be around the moon. And then they’re going to build on the moon to, to have a settlement there.
[00:24:04] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:24:05] Izzy House: And so…
[00:24:06] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:24:06] Izzy House: …we’re going to stay. And then a, a lot of other space stations that are coming online that we don’t foresee, you know, there’s a lot of the things like 3D printing that we, or the, the smartphone that we just, we don’t see coming and have impacted our lives in ways that you could not have forecasted. And so, there’s going to be a lot of things that are going to be happening before the end of the decade that we just don’t see coming and are going to change everything because technology’s moving fast.
And we all see this, but space is really moving fast. There’s a lot of new things happening all the time. It’s just an, an amazing thing. The pharmaceuticals, if they start developing their own space stations, that is going to revolutionize medicine in ways that we cannot foresee right now. And living off planet will change things. I mean, it’ll get to the point where it’s part of our everyday, just, “Oh, are you going to be taking a flight around the world?” Instead of doing a cruise around the world, you might do an orbit around the world. Space, space tourism is huge.
[00:25:28] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:25:28] Izzy House: And they have some stratospheric balloons that go up that you’re going to be able to take rides on and see the curvature of the earth. And when you can see the beauty of our planet not in a way that you could see any other way, you know, how is that going to affect you? It’s going to affect you going forward if you see that. It’s called the overview effect.
[00:25:51] Matt Bailey: Wow. Yeah.
[00:25:52] Izzy House: And you see how fragile our planet is, will want to take better care of it. So…
[00:25:58] Matt Bailey: Well, I remember them saying the, the first picture that was taken from the moon of the earth, that there was an effect on the people who saw that image, that for the first time seeing the earth from a never, from the outside perspective and the impact that that made on people in seeing that, that there was definitely a change. And so, now for other people to be able, for, you know, the more the mass population to actually experience, uh, rather than just seeing a photo. That I, I can imagine that would be an amazing experience.
[00:26:30] Izzy House: Well, and during that time, there was a intelligent man that was running the public affairs program for NASA during that time, which is why we have as much as we have and why we have the idea of space that we have. He was able to market space in such a way that we all felt it, we’ve all felt like we were a part of it. And they didn’t even want to film the first step on the moon because they were afraid, “Well, what if something bad happens?”
[00:27:03] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:27:03] Izzy House: It was a big conversation on, “Should we even do this?” And at the time we were going against Russia. Of course, why on earth would you give away all these secrets? And they fought and fought and fought and won. And how many lives has that first step on the moon changed? I mean, from that moment on…
[00:27:31] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:27:31] Izzy House: …it affects our days today because we all have an affinity for that moment. Everybody still knows and talks about that moment. What if they didn’t film it?
[00:27:45] Matt Bailey: Right. Right. Well…
[00:27:46] Izzy House: And how many companies, like what, what we’re talking about today, you, they don’t film it. They don’t let people know it’s even happening. And they’re so busy in developing it that they just, marketing has not been on their radar.
[00:28:03] Matt Bailey: Yeah, that’s amazing because, well, and, and you just look at how it affects the psyche of a people. You, you know, I wasn’t alive, but Kennedy’s speech about going to the moon, that, I think, was probably one of the best speeches I’ve, I’ve ever heard, especially a presidential speech. That we’re going to the moon not because it’s easy, but because it’s hard. Or “hod.” I love, I love that, you know, I, from the New England area originally, so I love that. But it was just a, a wonderfully impassioned speech about technology and we’re going to do this. And, you know, unfortunately he didn’t live to see what happened, but the, it wasn’t a long time before it did happen.
And I think people, you know, we haven’t been to the moon in how long? We’ve had numerous space shuttle missions going up, but we haven’t been to the moon, and I think maybe that’s part of, we’ve lost that, that national international wonder of what’s happening and what is, how the technology is driving this innovation and making life better.
When you don’t have that, I, I think that, that global vision of what’s happening, it, I think sometimes I, you know, I see the comments online and social media, like, “Well, we haven’t even been back to the moon. What’s with,” you know, there, there’s, it seems like we’ve lost that, that drive or that understanding of what’s going on. So, this, this concept of marketing space, I, I, I think becomes so much more important, not just for the commercialization, but it, it, it, I think this is what made Star Trek such a, you know, a, a, a touchstone in our history is that imagination part of it.
[00:29:44] Sponsor: Hey everyone, this is Matt, and thanks for listening. Just a quick break in the middle of the podcast here to let you know there’s a couple ways that you can connect with us. The first is learn.sitelogic.com. That’s the learning site where you can see courses on analytics, courses on digital marketing across paid search, SEO, multiple disciplines, and then also you can connect with us on Slack.
[00:30:00] Go to Slack if you’re there and look for us at endlesscoffeecup.slack.com. Connect with us. I’d love to hear from you, hear what ails you in the realm of digital marketing. Are there courses you need, information that you’d like to hear, or maybe some past guest that you’d like to hear more from? Thanks again for being a listener of the Endless Coffee Cup, and I look forward to hearing from you.
[00:30:41] Izzy House: Well, it, it tells us we can be better. You know, that we can reach great heights if we try. That we can succeed in, in conquering the impossible, because make no mistake, space is hard. It, it, it can kill you in an instant. It is not an easy thing to get through, to, to break through gravity. So, it is hard, but that’s one of the reasons why we love it so much, and because we have in us the need to try to do something hard and to try to be better. And, and I think space encapsulates that feeling of being the best we can be.
And that’s one of the things I, I also love about this industry is 99% of the people that I meet, they want to do good for the idea of doing good. They’re not in it to, you know, fleece customers. They’re not in it to, to make a buck, a lot of them.
[00:31:48] Matt Bailey: Well, that’s ’cause we don’t have a lot of marketers there yet. That’s…
[00:31:50] Izzy House: Right.
[00:31:50] Matt Bailey: …that’s part of it.
[00:31:52] Izzy House: And they’re, they’re in it to make things better.
[00:31:55] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:31:55] Izzy House: And they’re in it to do hard things and, and so it’s a, it’s a very inspiring group of people.
[00:32:02] Matt Bailey: Well, I imagine, like you said, it, it’s smart people doing things, trying things, and no one’s monetizing it, which is, you know, both good and bad. You, you know, I, sooner or later I think we’ll get our shysters up there what’s, with what’s going on. But I, I mean, it’s such a, a fascinating subject and yeah, not only raising awareness, but yeah, sooner or later some of these industries are going to have to market themselves.
And, and I, I don’t know. I don’t know why we don’t hear more about how some of these technologies have come about based in research, based in application in the space station and what they’re doing. I think we hear all the time that they’re doing experiments, but we don’t have a clue what those experiments are doing.
[00:32:45] Izzy House: Or that they relate to what we do every day.
[00:32:48] Matt Bailey: Yeah. Yeah.
[00:32:49] Izzy House: You, you know, like if you’re a diabetic checking your sugar, you don’t think about space when you do that.
[00:32:55] Matt Bailey: No.
[00:32:55] Izzy House: When you make a phone call, when you check traffic, you don’t think about space. And I think that just needs to be more of the narrative. A lot of narrative right now talks about how the rockets are polluting. And yes, let me tell you that that is one of the things that is exciting about this industry too, is because it does not need to be told, “You know what? You’re doing something that shouldn’t be done. It harms the earth.”
They do it on their own. They’re changing the fuels so that they don’t pollute. In fact, there is one company down in Florida called Vaya that is taking plastic bottles, recycled plastic bottles, and making rocket fuel into those, from those. And the exciting thing about that particular company is that their fuel doesn’t explode.
[00:33:48] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:33:48] Izzy House: So, you’re going to be able to have rockets in places that you may not have been able to have rockets before.
[00:33:54] Matt Bailey: So how does…
[00:33:54] Izzy House: It’s a…
[00:33:55] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:33:55] Izzy House: Yeah, a safe fuel.
[00:33:55] Matt Bailey: Well, it, it, tell me about this. This, if it doesn’t explode, what does it do? What…
[00:34:01] Izzy House: Well, the way that they, they have 3D printed this particular fuel, and they have a way that the other fuel goes through it, and I’m not an engineer. So, this is just…
[00:34:15] Matt Bailey: That’s okay. It’s okay.
[00:34:15] Izzy House: …what I’ve heard.
[00:34:16] Matt Bailey: You’re, we’re marketers. We, we, we, we can take the glossy version.
[00:34:20] Izzy House: So, and it’s, it’s a way that it burns the fuel without a lot of chemicals going into the atmosphere. There’s still a little bit of carbon, but nothing else that’s detrimental, and it’s using recycled material. So, it is actually a green rocket fuel.
[00:34:39] Matt Bailey: Well, we have a lot of plastic bottles around this planet, so I think we can scrounge a few to…
[00:34:44] Izzy House: Yes.
[00:34:44] Matt Bailey: …to work on that.
[00:34:46] Izzy House: I think one flight takes a million plastic bottles.
[00:34:51] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:34:53] Izzy House: So…
[00:34:53] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:34:53] Izzy House: …that’s a lot of plastic bottles.
[00:34:55] Matt Bailey: That is. That is amazing.
[00:34:57] Izzy House: So, recycle.
[00:34:58] Matt Bailey: Yes, really. Absolutely. Wow. That is so cool.
[00:35:02] Izzy House: Now, let’s just take that particular instance of that company going to space. What if we told them, “Nope, we have to take care of down here first. We don’t want you going to space.” What do you think that technology for using plastic bottles as fuel is going to do down here? I mean, everything comes back down to earth.
[00:35:26] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:35:27] Izzy House: So, as we reach farther, so I, I, you know, let’s, let the innovation keep coming.
[00:35:36] Matt Bailey: That is an amazing principle. And, and yeah, you outlined so many things already that were developed for the space program and have now filtered into our everyday lives. So, absolutely. That is a great compelling argument for that. And, and it, it also shows that those involved in the program know that this is an issue.
[00:35:56] Izzy House: Yes.
[00:35:56] Matt Bailey: And if it’s going to continue and we’re, I mean, I mean, how many, how many vertical launches are there in a day, in a month that, I mean, that are going on that we just don’t know about?
[00:36:12] Izzy House: Well, it’s getting more and more common, which is why we don’t hear about it.
[00:36:15] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:36:15] Izzy House: That’s another thing is the more common it becomes the less we hear about it. And that was one of the, the problems with the space shuttle program is that you only heard about things when something bad happened.
[00:36:26] Matt Bailey: Right. Yes.
[00:36:27] Izzy House: You know, you got so used to it that it didn’t even make the news. Well, Falcon 9 I think is going up weekly now…
[00:36:35] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:36:36] Izzy House: …or something very close. And do we hear about it? And the reason that a lot of those flights are happening is because of Starlink, which you may have heard of when he gave some, some Starlink equipment to the Ukraine.
[00:36:52] Matt Bailey: Yes.
[00:36:53] Izzy House: And they were able to connect.
[00:36:55] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:36:55] Izzy House: Well, imagine just the Starlink program to where everyone in the world is going to be able to communicate. How is that going to change our world? We cannot even fathom some of the changes that we’re going to see in the next, what, five years, just based off of that technology in space. And, you know, there’s a lot of people who say, “Well, you know, some of that’s good, some of it’s, some of it’s bad.” You know, there’s a lot of arguments on that.
But the thing is, what’s it going to do? It’s going to do good and bad and it’s going to, but I think it’s going to do more good than it will do bad. I mean, the Ukraine is able to get their message out to us because of this particular piece of equipment. It’s going to allow countries that could never afford this to all of a sudden, they can have commerce. It’s just, it’s going…
[00:37:57] Matt Bailey: Well…
[00:37:57] Izzy House: …to be amazing.
[00:37:58] Matt Bailey: And, and access to broadband is still an issue here in the U.S. Uh, we have many underserved communities or neglected communities. And now, you, you know, for someone growing up, you absolutely have to know your way around the internet to understand, to be familiar with the technology if you are going to further your education, if you’re going to go into any professional capacity. So, it’s, you know, again, that is one of those equalizers that, that is a must and, and, you know…
[00:38:31] Izzy House: Yes.
[00:38:31] Matt Bailey: …the fact that we need it in our country still speaks a lot to that. It’ll be interesting to see how, you, you know, dealing with competition and dealing with some legacy companies, how things are going to have to change in order to accompany some of this.
[00:38:46] Izzy House: Well, and some of that technology for data processing and communication is, will be developed so that we have the communication to the moon and to Mars. I mean, right now it takes like 40 minutes to get a message to and from Mars. It’s, it’s a, it’s a long way away. So, all that technology will be faster, will be better, will be stronger, and it’ll come down here.
[00:39:12] Matt Bailey: Wow. Well, you, just by way of example, you mentioned the pharmaceutical companies having their own space station. Now what’s a…
[00:39:20] Izzy House: Yes.
[00:39:20] Matt Bailey: …what’s a pharmaceutical company going to do with a space station?
[00:39:23] Izzy House: Well, the particular medicines when they mix, gravity changes that…
[00:39:28] Matt Bailey: It’s gravity again, yeah.
[00:39:29] Izzy House: …just like you were talking about with the steel, it, it, gravity makes the sediments, and the combinations work differently. So, having manufacturing of some of these medicines up in space, you will get cleaner proteins, you know, there’s a cellular structure or a crystal structure that is cleaner and bigger. They’re able to, they’re able to see disease easier with these structures, too, when they actually look at it. Parkinson’s, osteoporosis, all those come, are, are being researched in space because there’s a lot of bone loss with astronauts.
[00:40:00] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:40:07] Izzy House: So, that particular thing. There’s autoimmune issues, their immune, immune, is immune issues with astronauts. You know, there’s things that happen in space with these cells that make it to where you can see it better and you’re able to attack it better and you’re able to make better medicines to, in order to, to work with it. So, there’s Parkinson’s, a lot of Parkinson’s study up there right now that they’re, they’re doing some fabulous development to treat Parkinson’s.
[00:40:42] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:40:43] Izzy House: So, once these, these pharmaceuticals really grab ahold of the idea that they need their own space station to do some of this research, then you’re going to have Merck and you’re going to have Pfizer, you’re going to have all those companies doing their own. And what’s that going to do? Well, all of a sudden you have all these space stations that need service. A lot of that service can be done down here, which the space port could provide.
[00:41:13] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:41:13] Izzy House: And then you have a lot of services that need to be done up there. You, the Blue Origin is developing Orbital Reef, and then, then there’s solar and solar is, is actually changing, too. It’s becoming better. And solar, it has been developed because of satellites and, and whatnot. And we’re able to take that technology back down…
[00:41:36] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:41:36] Izzy House: …here, so.
[00:41:38] Matt Bailey: Okay. So…
[00:41:39] Izzy House: It’s…
[00:41:39] Matt Bailey: …wow. I, I mean…
[00:41:40] Izzy House: Yes.
[00:41:40] Matt Bailey: …this is blowing my mind, the, the opportunities and the amazing things. So, let me ask this, what are some of the obstacles to…
[00:41:50] Izzy House: Space.
[00:41:50] Matt Bailey: …space besides, you know, you could die quickly and quickly and, and…
[00:41:55] Izzy House: Gravity.
[00:41:56] Matt Bailey: …and specifically. Uh, gravity, yeah. Well, to some of the, to, to companies, I mean, I, I mean, there’s no licensing, is there that’s going on or, you, you know, traffic or, you know, what are some of the things that, uh, is, is, you know, that have to be dealt with in, in order to really commercialize this? And, and, and also, I’ll, I’ll wait on that next question. I, I will overload you.
[00:42:22] Izzy House: Oh, logistics. Yeah. List, logistics is actually a very major concern and then there’s the whole ethics and, you know, we just signed the Artemis Accords back during COVID. I, I got to see it via Zoom. It was amazing, yeah. I was, didn’t even know it was going to be happening. And that was amazing that I was like, “Oh my gosh, this is a historic moment.”
[00:42:45] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:42:45] Izzy House: And it, it basically says…
[00:42:47] Matt Bailey: What are, yeah. What are the Artemis, yeah, Accords if you could explain that?
[00:42:51] Izzy House: It’s, it’s a very basic document that says, “This is how we’re going to act in space. If we see somebody that needs help, this is what we’re going to do.” You know, this is, we’re, it’s, it’s the ethics of, “This is how we’re going to be.” And a lot of the countries signed it. There’s some that did not because they have other motives.
And see, you’re going to have the dark side of space, just like you had the dark side of, of ocean travel. You know, when people started venturing out into ships, it was the brave new world. It was exciting. It was getting to places you’d never been before, but then, you know, piracy happened and there’s, there’s, there’s things that happened there.
And then some of the governments, you know, weren’t all that great that set, got set up. So, “How is it going to look?” is a very big question that has started really developing another industry that’s related to space and that’s, that’s law. There’s a whole space law…
[00:44:01] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:44:02] Izzy House: …industry that is really blossoming as well, because how are we going to do it? There’s no lines up there. You know, who owns space? And so, a lot of it’s really taking shape as like the oceans in the maritists type, the maritime type of agreements that happened back when we were still thinking the world was flat. So…
[00:44:28] Matt Bailey: Wow. That is amazing.
[00:44:30] Izzy House: That…
[00:44:30] Matt Bailey: Absolutely.
[00:44:31] Izzy House: It is. And there, there’s, there’s some dangers, you know, what happens, like, for example, space debris is one of those things that are, are not positive. We have a lot of junk flying up around there…
[00:44:43] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:44:43] Izzy House: …and that junk is going 17,500 miles per hour. To give you kind of a, an idea, a bullet travels 1,800 miles per hour. So, this is like 9 times faster, 8 times faster than a bullet. That’s how fast this stuff is going. So, it can do some serious damage to a satellite, to a ship, to, to anything it runs across. And, and cleaning it up has its own problems of catching it. I mean…
[00:45:14] Matt Bailey: Right.
[00:45:15] Izzy House: …you’re catching something going faster than a bullet, but then what do you do with it? And who, who owns it? You know, what if it has technology that was secret technology that we really don’t want in the hands of somebody that we consider to be not friendly. You know, how, how do we deal with that?
[00:45:37] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:45:37] Izzy House: And that is a, a huge space law problem. And they’re, they’re trying to, to work out, the people that are working on cleaning up the debris, that’s one of the, the things that they’re, they’re, that is a very big concern or how are they deal with this technology that is super secret.
[00:45:57] Matt Bailey: Wow. Wow. It’s almost like we’re going to have a, a scavenger industry starting up…
[00:46:02] Izzy House: Yes.
[00:46:02] Matt Bailey: …to start catching these things and, and using them, or, or recycling…
[00:46:07] Izzy House: Recycling.
[00:46:08] Matt Bailey: …or something. Yeah. That’s amazing. But yeah, may be some good money in that industry.
[00:46:14] Izzy House: Well, so they’re going to take all this debris and they’re going to chop it up and they’re going to be able to make it into the material that you 3D print with.
[00:46:23] Matt Bailey: Oh, amazing. Absolutely…
[00:46:26] Izzy House: So…
[00:46:26] Matt Bailey: …amazing. So, here’s my other question. So, my daughter is a photographer. One of the things she absolutely loves doing is night photography with the Milky Way. She goes out to, uh, Joshua Tree Park and, one of her favorite places to do night photography. But one of the things that she and other photographers talk about is the amount of satellites that cross the photos.
[00:46:48] Izzy House: Yes.
[00:46:48] Matt Bailey: Um, and I, I thought I read somewhere that something’s being done about that. Uh, but…
[00:46:54] Izzy House: I hope so.
[00:46:55] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:46:56] Izzy House: You know, because light pollution is also a very big issue…
[00:47:00] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:47:00] Izzy House: …with seeing the night sky. It’s not just the satellites. It’s also the light pollution down here on planet. And I don’t know if you’ve noticed, but my neighborhood keeps getting brighter and brighter.
[00:47:10] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:47:11] Izzy House: You got, you have LED, which is great. It doesn’t use as much energy, which is great, but his, I can’t see the stars. You know, they replaced my lights and I mean, I, I spent the first 6 months just being mad because I couldn’t see my planets anymore. And, uh, but so, there, there are issues on that side and now there is eyes in the sky that, like we just had the James Webb…
[00:47:39] Matt Bailey: Yes.
[00:47:40] Izzy House: …fully, um, sent their, their first picture back from what they could see. That is huge. The James Webb is huge. We’re going to be able to see life on other planets with the James Webb. It is so fine-tune. It’s like the Hubble on steroids. You know, to give you kind of an example, when I first heard of the power of this, of telescope is that if it was looking down at earth, it could tell you what your odometer reading was. So, it is going to be able to see fires and lights and, and things that, that imply human civilizations on other planets.
[00:48:21] Matt Bailey: That is…
[00:48:21] Izzy House: It’s just, so we’re able to see more, but yet, I’m not really sure what they’re going to be doing about the amount of satellites in orbit. You know, like I said, they have 107,000 slated for this year.
[00:48:38] Matt Bailey: Amazing.
[00:48:40] Izzy House: So, sooner or later we got to get to a tipping point or we’re going to be…
[00:48:43] Matt Bailey: Oh…
[00:48:43] Izzy House: …we’re going to be WALL-E.
[00:48:45] Matt Bailey: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I think one of the things, I think it was Elon Musk, that they were working on a type of paint to put, uh, non-reflective paint on some of the satellites in order to eliminate some of the, that light pollution in the sky.
[00:49:01] Izzy House: Yes.
[00:49:02] Matt Bailey: But yeah, it’s, she’s got a little app on her phone that tells her where the best places to go where there’s less light pollution for that night photography. And it was interesting when I, when she was showing it to me, just how few places there are. And, and I think she told me something like, something about like less than 10% of the population on the earth sees the night sky as it was a hundred years ago.
[00:49:28] Izzy House: I remember growing up and I could see the Milky Way as clean as, as, and as bright…
[00:49:33] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:49:33] Izzy House: …as beautiful as anything. And I don’t see it anymore from where I live.
[00:49:37] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:49:37] Izzy House: So, yes. That, that’s, that’s a sad thing. But now not only is it affecting our night sky from just viewing it, which, you know, is important, but it’s also affecting getting beyond our orbit because it is a very challenging thing to organize a launch to where you’re not hitting that, those satellites in there. It, it’s like, there’s a very small window and if they can’t, don’t meet that window, the flight is scrubbed.
[00:50:00] Matt Bailey: Wow. Wow.
[00:50:13] Izzy House: So, I mean, it’s like down to like 10 minutes. So, that is a concern. Sooner or later, they’re going to have to have like, just like where we live is going to be designated property and there’s going to be so many and so it, it, but you do have depth. You do have a lot of space. I mean, space is big. So, you, we, we do have a little bit, but it is something that is being discussed…
[00:50:41] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:50:42] Izzy House: …quite, quite, quite a bit and getting the debris out.
[00:50:46] Matt Bailey: So, let me ask you this. We’re, we’re kind of, I, I can’t believe it, we’ve been talking this long already. Let me ask you this. What is, what’s maybe a day in the life or a week in the life of a space marketer? What do you do?
[00:51:00] Izzy House: Well, there’s two sides to it. There’s one where I’m teaching the companies that are not used to marketing, “What is marketing?”
[00:51:08] Matt Bailey: Oh yeah. Yeah.
[00:51:09] Izzy House: And I’m also, you know, trying to give the best of marketing. I’m, I’m teaching principles that are not sleazy, that are not…
[00:51:17] Matt Bailey: Sure.
[00:51:18] Izzy House: …that don’t sheer their customers. They, they develop relationships with their customers.
[00:51:22] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:51:23] Izzy House: Because I don’t care if it’s internet or if it’s a hundred years ago and it’s newspaper. Developing relationships with your customers is what succeeds, period. The tools that we do it with, it changes. And let me tell you, it is hard sometimes to keep up with those changes, but it’s still that connection to your customer and it’s giving the, your customer value that makes it to where it’s a relationship. And when you try to just take it from them, you’ll never win. I don’t care how great your marketing tactics are. If they fleece your customers, sooner or later they will go away.
[00:52:10] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:52:11] Izzy House: They don’t have to stay with you anymore. So, it’s basically teaching them how to market healthily and that’s important. But then on the other side of it, there’s all kinds of opportunities that space presents. Like, for example, in the International Space Station, there’s Adidas, there’s Estee Lauder, they’re doing things up there and…
[00:52:34] Matt Bailey: What, I’m sorry. What’s Adidas doing in the ISS? This is…
[00:52:38] Izzy House: I think they’re doing something with plastics…
[00:52:42] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:52:43] Izzy House: …that is doing, they’re bringing it back down, there’s something they’re doing that’s positive to the environment. I’m, I’m not exactly sure of what they’re doing, but I know they’re up there.
[00:52:54] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:52:54] Izzy House: And Estee Lauder’s doing something up there and Target, I believe Target is up there.
[00:53:01] Matt Bailey: So, the brands are…
[00:53:01] Izzy House: So…
[00:53:02] Matt Bailey: …already up there doing things and…
[00:53:04] Izzy House: Yes.
[00:53:04] Matt Bailey: …developing more products or, or that, that’s just, that’s blowing my mind. That’s…
[00:53:11] Izzy House: So, you, you know, and for example, one of my favorite marketing particular ploys that I saw was with Elon Musk. It was when the Falcon 9 launched up into space. They had to do a test and they opened up to release their cargo, and instead of that, all they had to do was a concrete block. That’s all they had to do. But Elon Musk does not do what you think he’s going to do. And he launched a Tesla…
[00:53:40] Matt Bailey: I remember that. Yes. Yes.
[00:53:42] Izzy House: …with a spaceman and this Tesla is full of Easter eggs that really connect with the average person. Inside the glove compartment is a “Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy.”
[00:53:54] Matt Bailey: Aw.
[00:53:55] Izzy House: It’s blaring David Bowie. It’s, it’s, it’s full of marketing, but it also is full of story.
[00:54:05] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:54:06] Izzy House: It’s full of connection. It’s full of relationship. And you can still see where he is. He’s, he’s orbiting Mars. So, you can, there’s a, a website that you can go to and see where he is. His name is Starman, by the way.
[00:54:20] Matt Bailey: Starman.
[00:54:20] Izzy House: And so, that’s, it all, all it had to do was be a concrete block.
[00:54:25] Matt Bailey: Yeah.
[00:54:26] Izzy House: But yet he created a story that is still going.
[00:54:28] Matt Bailey: Amazing. Amazing.
[00:54:30] Izzy House: So…
[00:54:31] Matt Bailey: Wow.
[00:54:31] Izzy House: And it’s just developing those relationships, telling those stories.
[00:54:36] Matt Bailey: So, yeah. You’re, so you’re teaching scientists, you’re teaching these companies how to market more effectively. What’s the other half of what you’re doing?
[00:54:44] Izzy House: Telling people that space is something that is connected to them. That it’s every breath we take, literally, because it’s from space that we’re going to heal the planet.
[00:54:59] Matt Bailey: Fantastic. That is so exciting. And it’s, it’s, it’s invigorating. Izzy, I, I, this is so, like every time I have talked with you, I come away just more excited. I feel more positive. You, you just are so infectious with your excitement about space and what’s happening and, and, you know, I think the rest of the night now, that’s what I’m going to be talking about is like, this was just such the greatest conversation. I, I so appreciate your time and, and coming on and just sharing a little bit about what’s happening and, and what you’re doing in, and all the puns are just all over the place. And what you’re doing in this space and in this.
[00:55:38] Izzy House: That’s the marketing part of us, too.
[00:55:40] Matt Bailey: I know, right? Right. Well, Izzy…
[00:55:43] Izzy House: We can come up with those stories.
[00:55:45] Matt Bailey: Absolutely. Well, Izzy, thank you so much for your time. This is, I feel like we just scratched the surface of, you know, what’s going on. And, and so, I, I would love to ask you back to do a follow-up on this. I, I’m, I’m, I confess you sent me your book. I have not read it yet, but I am going on a long trip, and so I’m going to read it. I, I…
[00:56:04] Izzy House: I have audible.
[00:56:05] Matt Bailey: Oh yeah, that’s right. That’s right.
[00:56:07] Izzy House: I have audible.
[00:56:08] Matt Bailey: I will probably…
[00:56:09] Izzy House: I’ll send you one.
[00:56:09] Matt Bailey: I, I like it on, I like it on the pad. I, I like it, if I’m traveling, I’ve got to have it digitally, but otherwise I like the regular book, but I’m going to get into that and we’re going to have a follow-up because I think as I get more into your book, I’m going to have a lot more questions.
[00:56:23] Izzy House: Sounds good.
[00:56:24] Matt Bailey: Alright.
[00:56:24] Izzy House: And it’s been a pleasure.
[00:56:25] Matt Bailey: Oh, thank you so much, Izzy. By the way, where can people find you? If they have questions or would like to contact you, how can they find you?
[00:56:34] Izzy House: My website is izzy.house. And, you know, there’s .coms, there’s .biz, well, there’s also .house.
[00:56:41] Matt Bailey: Nice.
[00:56:42] Izzy House: And my last name just happens to be House. So, izzy.house, I Z Z Y. And there, you can catch me there and there’s links to my podcast, which is spacemarketingpodcast.com. And I’m, yeah, so LinkedIn is my absolute favorite social media, and I am on LinkedIn, as well.
[00:57:04] Matt Bailey: Fantastic. Ah, beautiful. Thank you so much, Izzy. This has been such an enjoyable conversation and I’m looking forward to the next one already.
[00:57:13] Izzy House: Me too. Thank you.
[00:57:15] Matt Bailey: Alright. And thank you, dear listener, for tuning in to another edition of the Endless Coffee Cup podcast. I hope you had a great time with this and listening to what’s happening in space. So, until next time, thank you so much for tuning in to the Endless Coffee Cup podcast.
[00:57:33] Bumper Intro-Outro: This podcast is heard along the Marketing Podcast Network. For more great marketing podcasts, visit marketingpodcasts.net.